[ZS] Update to how Ranking is Determined in the Battle Arena

Discussion in 'Announcements' started by mi7ch, Dec 5, 2013.

  1. mi7ch

    mi7ch Administrator

    Recently there's been some concern here on the forums about inactive players in the Battle Arena placing highly when the Arena is over. While it is totally a player's choice whether or not they want to participate actively in any given Arena, it wasn't fair to higher level players for these inactive accounts to be placing highly when the Arena ended.

    As such, we've made a few changes to how active/inactive players are placed when an Arena ends. If you meet the minimum 100 attacks to qualify as an active player, you will be ranked normally based on the time you were eliminated from the Arena. If you fail to meet the minimum 100 attacks, you will be considered inactive and ranked below active players on the leaderboard. Inactive players will be ranked against each other based on attack count. As a side-effect of this change, your reward can only be collected when the Arena ends.

    If needed, we may adjust the minimum requirements. For example, the 100 attack minimum may change and possibly hitting a minimum number of unique opponents may be required. This will be based on reviewing the upcoming arenas and stats. This change will be in effect for the December 9 Battle Arena on Zombie Slayer.

    If you have any questions or feedback about this change, please leave it here. :)
  2. RainSunGone

    RainSunGone Well-Known Member

    sounds like a move in the right direction :)

    SHO KOSUGI Member

    This might a bit out of topic, is it possible to collect my previous arena reward while playing in the new round?
  4. mi7ch

    mi7ch Administrator

    @SHO KOSUGI rewards needs to be collected before the next Arena starts.
  5. God of Bacon

    God of Bacon Member

    Very good. Can't say enough how much this was needed. Thanks for this change :)
  6. AlterEgoT

    AlterEgoT Well-Known Member

    I would have loved this before. But now that it has become so hard to do anything in the arena if you are built defensibly not so much.

    I suppose my new strategy will be to hit something 100 times right before I die.
  7. God of Bacon

    God of Bacon Member

    Why bother doing that? The rewards you get for actually attacking are better than you'd get from switching defense on until the end.
  8. Kreistor

    Kreistor New Member

    My problem here is that you use the word "choice". There is no choice for many working individuals. Three out of the last four Arenas, I have been working, and only just started most times. That means up to 8 hours of waiting before I can log in and participate. I have returned to find myself dead, every time. Twice, yes, I got UN reward just for entering. I don't doubt that's due to my equipment.

    The second difficulty is in gaining the experience necessary to learn how to play. My one successful entry I lasted 2 minutes, and never really learned anything. Despite being in the top 40 players on the Kong/AG level leaderboard, I know nothing about Arenas. And, frankly, I doubt I'll ever learn, given that I only get one try every 3 months. There is simply no opportunity to learn unless you can play any time of day, any day of the month. Those of us from AG are lacking a full year of competitive intelligence on teh Arena system: we are at a distinct disadvantage against Kong players out of the gate.

    Given that some higher level Kong players claim they'll gain 20 levels from Arenas, this is not a trivial event to someone like me, a fast leveler. You are choosing to cut me off, not because I don't choose to play, but because the style of competition promotes those with large amounts of time on their hands.

    Faction Wars, on the other hand, are far more conducive to the working stiff. It runs a predictable 4 days, plays when the worker can choose to, and since the timing on Token regeneration is less than 300 per 9 hours, a worker loses no advantage to the non-worker. the problem is that it generally rewards about 6 levels compared to the Arena's 20.

    So, I'd like you to take a step back, look at the situation, and really decide whether "choice" is currently a significant part of the reward system. There is none: you can get online to defend yourself or not. I need to eat. You don't pay the bills. No brainer.
  9. Survival Streak 0

    Survival Streak 0 Active Member

    Is this a new change?

    Last edited: Dec 7, 2013
  10. Linda

    Linda Guest

    Top Poster Of Month

    So I am guessing that is what someone who did not get the min 100 hits but ranks will see this?? If I were you collect it now lol I think I have seen that in one of the arena's at one time, I rarely play in two of them as I am a pretty low level and was not interested so just joined for the XP.
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 7, 2013
  11. Survival Streak 0

    Survival Streak 0 Active Member

    ugh im slow today, of course it's a new thing...the only reason i had two rewards to collect was cause the reward at top was from the arena that was still in progress.

    With this new system I'd of had to wait until the arena that was in progress to finish before getting a reward :rolleyes:
  12. im the beast

    im the beast Member

    Ideas were brought up to get rid of the Player Health Reward for killing a player so people couldnt figured out who is who. Ideas were said make the Arena where no one would know who's who. That way you would actually have a REAL WINNER, instead of a PICKED ONE.

    would be the worse ideal in the world..y u ask b/c i for one like to go after health reward between 120 and 220 b/c they r the best exp for me..anything lower and i might not level and anything higher might not be worth hitting as i might lose to much health.. yes there r exception not all big player hurt me when i attack them but some do and i try to stay away from them unless i friend need help or one is trying to kill me and so on.but taking reward away or not knowing reward b4 you go after a players is just dumb and wouldn't change ranking one bit. good players will always tell other good players there name and you r stuck on this ba is decided... your right to a point yes sometimes it is but thats not even talked about til there is only 10 players letf until then everyone is game..i say jonnhy save you 100 to 400 un and play a ba get ur health to 4 to 6 trill and u can have a chance at winning.and i think a better update to ba would have been taking def mode away from player that hasnt hit anything once the first tier starts.. thats fair to player like me who do spend and then wouldnt have to wait hours for na actives to be able to be killed. b/c to me thats about the worse part is waiting for player who dont do anything but def mode the whole time to come out to have everyone left watching and waiting...blah lol...if all inactives came out of def mode at same time there would be less sniping less waiting... anyways just my 2 cent...
  13. polishpimp

    polishpimp Well-Known Member

    Comparing wars and the arena to world bosses is apples and oranges.....world bosses dont fight back. The arena and the wars were both designed with the PVP player in mind. Regardless of participation numbers thats who they were designed to appease so those are the players that should reap the benefit. Inactive players serve a purpose in that they serve up XP for the actives but that doesnt warrant them better rewards....it warrants them the free XP they get for entering and a shot at what ever rewards might remain after the active fighters get their due.
  14. AlterEgoT

    AlterEgoT Well-Known Member

    Mostly agree. But again, they've jacked with the arena so much that even for some of the large accounts it simply isn't worth the stamina. I get more XP on bosses than I do in the arena now being built defensively it just takes too much stam with too little damage to bother blowing through my stam at such a high rate.

    But eh 100 attacks? sure I can drop 100 stam if it makes them feel like I am active enough.

    My point is simply they have changed the arena to the point that if you don't have their precise build, live in the correct time zone, and have a pack you fight with it's really just not worth it. This eliminates many of the active players from bothering.

    Like so many things in the game, in a rush to fix what wasn't broken they took the fun out of it :/
  15. Blasphamy

    Blasphamy Member

    I, for one, am all about limiting the inactive rewards. It's an understood thing that players work, players have different builds, etc... that's why there is a prescribed format for BA, a prescribed format for the FW and a prescribed format for the actual game. None of which are entirely similar, but each to appease different demographics of players.

    I get my backside handed to me in the actual game due to a weaker defense, but I built my slayer to the BA spec sheet because for me, it's the most bang for the buck (so to speak). I'll probably never get the achievements in game for 1,000 consectutive fight wins, 7500 def, 10k def.... but I sure as heck can push 60k attacks and gain 18 million exp in BA, and so can anyone else if they are willing to put their UN into it. If you are not willing to put forth the required effort to be competitive, then you should be content with the results as they are governed.

    Defensive builds are great for defense timers and all that, but the Battle Arena is an all out slug fest.... how can you win a fight that you never throw a punch in? It makes no sense to me.

    I like the change as I like the idea of full participation. I'm sure that it'll take a time or two (or five, lol) to get the bugs out and I'm also sure KANO will hear even more negative feedback from impatient players who demand immediate results, but I agree with RainSun that it is a step in the right direction.
  16. God of Bacon

    God of Bacon Member

    Funny, 3 out of the last 4 arenas I wasn't around either. I actually forgot to sign up. I know many people who have actually talked to their coworkers into changing shifts with them to work a different day so they could have the day of arena off. You do have the choice, you're just choosing work over a game. It's easily the smarter choice without question, but still a choice.

    In reference to not being able to learn about arena it would've been a smart choice to listen to me when you were starting out the game. I advised you to add to attack and defense instead of energy and stamina and you chose not to. Now you've gotten to a considerably high level in a matter of a few months. Some people have been playing for almost a year and haven't reached your progress in levels. The reason is that they built themselves for PvP and you didn't. Battle Arena is an all-out PvP aspect of the game. You're not going to last long against people who have put in the time, and effort to build themselves big and strong just because you have a high number next to your name.

    This is an MMO. Teamwork is necessary, and anyone who hasn't taken the time to either get big themselves, or make big friends isn't going to succeed. Imagine if you will, a huge colloseum where hundreds of people are fighting at once. There are going to be fighters making alliances to help them, and if someone comes in and takes a kill, the other person is most likely going to go after them. It's called strategy. It seems as if the way you think arena will be fair is to eliminate teamwork, and strategy.
  17. Blasphamy

    Blasphamy Member

    Hey, look at what I found - Straight from the BA Help page:

    -You need kills if you want to last and rank higher in the arena, leaving things to chance and hiding out will not guarantee you a good rank

    -The better your attack perk, the more guaranteed minimum damage you'll do to that target

    -Help from a friend is also another good way to counter attack during times of heavy attacks from one attacker.

    -Contact friends and coordinate attacks, share target names and find them using the find interface located at the top of the fight list.

    And it even goes above and beyond to fully explain you individual 'perk' status. It's amazing that KANO has actually put a ton of thought into FULLY explaining how your very own creation will fare in BA, up to giving you a % breakdown of your stats to show you exactly what you can expect. It explains that teamwork is critical. It explains how to do well. It says in the KILLS section that you NEED them to do well. It lays it out in exact detail how to do well inside this mini-game.

    It is not KANO's fault that you, the slayer creator, do not or did not follow their guide to receive the benefits that can come from BA. So, let's take some personal responsibility in how our own slayers perform, shall we?
  18. polishpimp

    polishpimp Well-Known Member

    I hear ya. ZS is a bit diff than the other games as there is much less focus on stamina on average. With that said...I also agree that the arena is not very High level friendly....even for the more balanced or attack heavy accounts. High levels with balanced or high attack dont get very good XP from anyone and when combined with the handicap which causes them to also lose to accounts they normally wouldnt....the XP is actually horrendous. Ive won my fair share of arenas and its rare that I ever come out ahead. Basically all it allows for is bragging rights and a break from the monotony of the regular game. In the end the rewards simply dont merit the investment if indeed thats what one is looking for. The arena has always been a disappointment in that way. The fact that so many inactives were ranking well and robbing active players of the meager rewards was just salt in the wound.

    Yeah....the 100 attack minimum is pretty much a joke...it pretty much makes this update a "token" update by Kano so they can say "hey....look we listened to our players". It takes what..all of a couple of seconds and 100 stam and BAM....were eligible again...lol

    Personally I think the attack slider is at the root of the problem as far as kanoplay/myspace goes. When the arena was first introduced it just simply took to long and the rewards def were not were the time and effort. The attack slider was a good idea but apparently they didnt account for the affect it would have on other aspects of the arena like the amount of defensive stance some players have. Now players can pretty much ride out an entire arena in defensive stance after they take a few seconds to get the minimum. Im all for a solid defense and what it affords but Ive serious doubts thats how the arena was intended to be. Back when the arena was new and it took much longer players of all builds and levels had more opportunity to get in there and mix it up and at the least get some levels due to the simple fact there was a much bigger range of opponents available to them for a longer period. Currently....with the rate players are being killed off it restricts all but the most powerful accounts.

    There are exceptions of course, Ive done ok (in terms of rank and a few levels)with a couple of my lesser level accounts....but i literally have to man my account every minute of the arena and the pay off is is anything but worth the time. In comparison....before the slider I could get dozens of levels and could have cared less about rank. Kano has taken away the motivation for players to join, the days of mass leveling are gone for those who dont stand a real chance of ranking. The rewards for ranking well dont merit the investment. The newness of the arena wore off a long time ago and they let inactives rule for way to long. They need bring back real opportunity for all types of builds n levels by limiting or eliminating the attack slider dependent on the participation numbers of each arena. Then they need to bump up the rewards considerably all the way from #1 down to #100. Although this update teases/hints at correcting an injustice that has gone on to long....its simply not enough. Where the motivation for the masses to actually take the time or use the resources if they still dont have a realistic chance at recouping a smidgen of what they put into it? We want more active players but in the end there is still going to be a handful of players regularly performing well, if Im not one of those guys than why would I want spend multiple refills and hours on end when realistically IO have a shot at 1, 2 or 3 FP? Kano acts like they have to have actual gold in the reserve for all the FP they print up. Its time they loosen the purse strings and make it worth the active minded players time. This update is far to little to late and does very little to re-motivate players.

    My apologies for the rant, its def not directed at you...I just got rolling and couldnt stop....lol
  19. God of Bacon

    God of Bacon Member

    Wow I know a few times I've argued against your point when it came to battle arena, but I don't think what you said could be more right. So many people want something altered so they can start to win simply because they're lazy and don't put the effort in.
  20. Survival Streak 0

    Survival Streak 0 Active Member

    I like the change, let's us see how many really play, from the recent arena results
    On FB Rank 131 - 1099 did not make the 100 attacks needed to be classed as 'active'
    On Kong it was 49 - 286
    On Kanoplay is was (will edit when that arena is over)
    So wow! look how many didn't actually play this time round

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