I wanna know how the fight system works

Everything that I have is of UN Purchase + I have a higher squad than the other opponent. This isn't wat really bothers me. What bothers me is how can I lose to a person who's squad is less and with lower lvld equips attatched? Even fully upgraded that person would not be able to beat me with a lvl 2 Bugatti and Lvl 2 Roman Gladiator Armor. So how exactly does this system work?
Yes, I did lose this fight...

http://i647.photobucket.com/albums/uu194/BPShockwave/ZombieSlayers.jpg
http://i647.photobucket.com/albums/uu194/BPShockwave/ZombieSlayers2.jpg

 

Your attack is only 3 and your opponent there has a defense of at least 52. Even if all your top squad are the strongest players your squad's attack strength is limited to 3x the number of squad members because of your attack strength...

Does that make sense?

 

Your attack is 42 while his defense is 518. His top squad members must be of higher levels than your squad members. At least, that's how I understand it. If I'm wrong, please let me know.

 

You are partially correct, if you have low attack say 3 and you have full squad say 10 with an attack of 10 each, even though your top squad added together would be 100 because your attack is 3 your top squad attack used would be limited by your attack so only 30 would count in the attack.

This limiting is to prevent a low level player from adding all high level players and becoming a power house without actually investing any skill into their attack. Basically your top squads avg attack/defense is limited to what your current attack/defense is.

Does that make sense?

 

Absolutely. I'm constantly getting this message:

Your Top Squads attack and defense strength is being limited by your characters attack and defense, raise your characters attack and defense strength to take full advantage of your Top Squads strength.​

Around half of my Top Squad is a higher level than me. And the Hired Squad I have has been upgraded a few times, back when I didn't know anyone on MySpace yet. Every now and then, after leveling a few times in one day maybe, the message will go away.

 

Perhaps a Squad Profile is in order. Unless I am missing something there is no where to see what your squad is using other than the fight screen.

I am going to refer to Mafia Wars again (it really is the game I have delved the furthest into and the one with the most bloody mistakes made by a developer that I have seen lol) and tell you that there are a ton of 3rd party tools out there to parse out what you're using in fighting.

Now ZS has helped that issue by making your Squad much smaller but still it's a bit of a pain. Having a Squad Profile that showed what your total attack and defense are, what gear you are using to attack (and defend, do you use different gear to defend? I assume the game chooses the best gear for you in each situation).

The more information the players are given makes the game that much deeper in my opinion. I like that I can spend time upgrading my gear, buying new gear and upgrading that when it becomes available etc. I'd just like that info at my fingertips is all =)

 

This. This, this, a thousand times this. A nice screen or tab I can pull up that says "On Defense, your Top Squad will use...." and "On Offense, your TS will fight using the following items..."

 

What I don't get and is why I posted those screen shots is that when I have a higher squad with higher weapons, gear, explosives and w/e that car thing is called... How are they able to beat me if what I have is higher all together combined? What I mean and I don't mean to sound illiterate in this game is that even if my squad was limited by my attack and my defense how am I losing to a player who has absolutely less than me in every field plus to add on that their probably limited by their attack and defense (meaning that their squads limited by the players attack and defense)? This game is like all others and just doesn't make any sense.

 

Well, let me put it this way...

I give you a rifle. A really nice one. The type doesn't matter. You don't know how to use it very well.

I take a rifle, a lower-quality, but servicable model. We go out to a distance, then we fight.

Now, I don't know about you, but, FOR PURPOSES OF THIS DISCUSSION, we will presume that you are not very well skilled in martial arts (general skills of combat, not simply Tae Kwon Do and the like).

Now, I've had military training, I practice at the shooting range regularly*, I understand the basics of security, methods of patrolling, and I've actually been learning archery this year.

Without skill, without training, all the gear in the world is useless. You have to know how to USE your equipment. Simply having it is not enough.

* Hell, I've taught a solid dozen people proper use, care, and handling of firearms in the last two years. My GF is a better shot than I, and I taught her.... -_-

 

I don't understand this. The fight details show that he is stronger than me in this section, even though I have more gear units and all my gear is upgraded, whereas his isn't. I realize some of his gear may be UN gear, but I'm not sure which ones. But is that why I'm weaker? A couple UN pieces can beat more upgraded items? If that's the case, why not just spend a few bucks and get 20 of everything the UN offers? Then nobody could beat me? That doesn't seem right.. the more real money I spend, the less beatable I am? Lame.

My 20 Gear Units
* 1 Military Uniform (Level 4)
* 6 Gondolier Uniforms (Level 3)
* 1 Medieval Armor (Level 3)
* 1 Goalie Gear (Level 3)
* 1 Napoleon Uniform (Level 3)
* 1 Bobby Uniform (Level 3)
* 6 Chef Uniforms (Level 2)
* 3 Swat Team Kevlar Vests (Level 2)


His 14 Gear Units
* 2 Italian Leather Suits (Level 1)
* 2 Gondolier Uniforms (Level 1)
* 1 Chef Uniform (Level 1)
* 1 Napoleon Uniform (Level 1)
* 1 Medieval Armor (Level 1)
* 1 Doctor's Coat (Level 1)
* 1 Bobby Uniform (Level 1)
* 1 Real Madrid Uniform (Level 1)
* 1 Bullfighting Uniform (Level 1)
* 1 Geurilla Camoflage (Level 1)
* 1 Jiu Jitsu Gi (Level 1)
* 1 Hunting Jacket (Level 1)

 

he probably put alot of points into defense, since you cant see their stats you have no way of knowing how many points they put into it..I know that I have a full top squad myself and my attack isnt the greatest but I have my attack skill set at around 1 times my level and like 90% of people the same size as me beat me......

 

The question is not size but strength. There are a lot of people out there with warm bodies filling their top squad or energy players that aren't that strong. Your top squad, unlike Mafia Wars (I noticed you mentioned that in another thread) does actually have to play and for you to be a fighter they should have fighter stats as well.

If you click the show details after a fight you'll see your Top Squads attack vs their defense. Although for my personal game play an attack of 1x is too low it should be enough for you to be winning around 50% of your fights with people of equal size so I am guessing it's the fact that your Top Squad is too weak although there are a ton of other things such as gear that matters too.

Here is a perfect example. I usually pick people with the same squad size as me for max experience but this person paid me 5xp for a win lol and you'll see why, either he has no personal defense and that is limiting his squad or his squad is all warm bodies. Both have 17 members

Me
Top Squad Attack Strength: 2380

Him
Top Squad Defense Strength: 34

 

I think no matter what at least in the "gear" category you will always show up as weaker because every gear item has twice as much defense as attack so you will never have stronger gear than your opponent if you are on the attack....not sure about the cars but you need to look at how you rate in every category :squad strength, attack skill, weapons etc...

 

Exactly.

Italian Leather Suit (Level 4): Attack: +15 Defense: +28
Guard's Uniform (Level 1) Attack: +6 Defense: +21



More specifically...
Stab Vest (Level 1) Attack: 0 Defense: 1
Big Tex Outfit (Level 1)Attack: 0 Defense: +2

Every armor up to and including the Bull Fighting Uniform is +0 attack, so you really only have eight armors that provide an attack bonus, Fate.

Let's see.... Real Madrid: +1 attack.

Prison Uniform and Street Bandana: +3 each? times five is 15, so +16 attack.

Goalie Gear at level 4 is +12 attack, and that's more than your level 2, but we'll still say 28, for purposes of this discussion. (A level 2 Truck Driver Helmet is +6, so say +22 for you pedants out there).

Finally, your newb suit: I can't actually find mine, so I'm just going to use....

Eh, this will work...

Scuba Gear (Level 3) Attack: +7 Defense: +14


This puts your Gear offense at +35 (+29), and that's using better equipment than what I have, so it will actually be less.

One Newb Suit: I think +9?
Bull Fighting Level 2 is +11, so +31
Real Madrid is +10, so with only four sets of armor, we've topped your gear offense with +41 defense on gear.

MATH IS NOT HARD NOR TIME CONSUMING.

 

When I get this right

then there is absolutely no use in buying extra gear for the Gear Units with UN Points?
For example I would still be weaker even if I had 20 Roman Gladiator Armors? So better spend UNs for Vehicles and Weapons?

 

No.

The UN stuff IS worth buying. Firstly because their stats are reasonably close like 57/60 etc and secondly because without even being upgraded 57/60 is higher than anything else in the game. When upgraded they kick ass.

Having 20 of each of the UN stuff for weapons, armor and vehicles will have you kicking ass in that department. You still need personal stats to back them up though.

 

Thanks for the quick reply. Well, then I keep buying UN stuff
But will the UN items become useless on the higher levels?

Just wondering, because the higher the levels the stronger the weapons you get.
The strongest regular (non UN) weapon I own is the Alphorn (49/41 Level 4) and I'm only level 218.
Will there be weapons on higher levels with an attack/defense which is similar to the UN items? They all have around 67/66.

 

I'm currently level 305 and only have Russia to open up. I have a lot of UN stuff and almost always have higher weapon, armour and vehicle stats than players many levels above me. I only ever really lose on personal/squad strength.

Later in the game the the weapons and stuff that drop are worth having and have good stats but this won't help you until you get to a point where you can have 20 of them. Their stats do get close(r) to the UN stuff but when fully upgraded the UN items are still the strongest ones you can have.

If you think about it it's perfectly sensible from a business perspective that the best gear in th game needs to be paid for otherwise nobody would buy it.

Also, if you are going use UN credits to buy it you may as well do it sooner rather than later as they will be more of an advantage to you at lower levels. The higher you go the more UN stuff people have

 

Im in Russia and i can tell you for sure that there while the weapons, gear and vehicles available are good they still dont get near the Limited Edition UN items

The Steins you get from german Co-op boss beat any weapon you can buy and the gloves you get for the russian single bosses are slightly better but still about 15 points att/def behind LE UN items

 

I've just got into Russia too now and this appears to be the case